1 / 5. Home - Niall of the Nine Hostages - hughmckenna.org I may be wrong though. hunting with his four brothers. 85% of Irish men belong to a paternal lineage called R1b1b2, but since this line is also common across the rest of western Europe, it doesnt definitively determine if a man has Irish ancestry. Niall succeeds to the High Kingship, and Brin becomes his second in command. Niall moved across the Shannon where he founded the dynasty of Uisnech in Westmeath. By another wife, Mon Fionn, daughter of the King of Munster, Eochaid had four sons, Brian, Fiachar, Ailill, and Fergus. [3] Byrne, following James Carney, is a little more precise, dating his death to c. geneticists collected a number of samples from men across Ireland. The saga "The Death of Niall of the Nine Hostages" says that he received five hostages from the five provinces of Ireland (Ulster, Connacht,Leinster, Munster and Meath), and one each from Scotland, the Saxons, the Britons and the Franks. According to 23andMe.com, "The spread of haplogroup R-M269 in northern Ireland and Scotland was likely aided by men like Niall of the Nine Hostages. Can I trust a Haplogroup from 23&Me? - WikiTree G2G provide water, but she wants a kiss in return. County Mayo folks have Viking blood as well as that of Niall of the Hostages. I was just wandering because it said most Irish have the common ancestor as well. Talk about your genes and their possible implications! The little Irish (Scotic) colony in that part of Alba just opposite to Antrim had gradually been growing in numbers, strength, and prestigeuntil they excited the jealousy and enmity of the Picts, who tried to crush them. Press J to jump to the feed. To see the names of the first thirty-five descendants from Adam, the invention of those Irish monks, go to Ancient Irish Lineage on the Our Early Family web site. When Maximus and his Roman legions were, in consequence of the barbarian pressure upon the Continental Roman Empire, withdrawing from Britain, Niall, with his Irish hosts and Pictish allies, treaded upon their hurrying heels." Ruling from Tara, Niall's modus operandi for gaining dominance was taking signature is created. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1195848313/niall-and-the-stone http://www.genealogy4u.com/genealogy/getperson.php?personID=I17949& http://www.dcs.hull.ac.uk/cgi-bin/gedlkup/n=royal. the right to found a royal line elsewhere in Ireland. Niall of the Nine Hostages Irish leader Learn about this topic in these articles: association with Conn In Conn Ctchathach to be the ancestor of Niall of the Nine Hostages (reigned 379-405), who founded the U Nill, the greatest dynasty in Irish history. [6 ] Indeed, Keating describes her not as a Saxon but as the "daughter of the king of Britain". What is a maternal line? Mongfind, purporting to make peace between her brother and her sons, holds a feast, at which she serves Crimthann a poisoned drink. [6] Mongfind appears to have been a supernatural personage: the saga "The Death of Crimthann mac Fidaig" says the festival of Samhain was commonly called the "Festival of Mongfind", and prayers were offered to her on Samhain eve.[11]. In the Abruptly, the tale then has Niall appearing before an assembly of Pictish bards in Scotland, where he is killed by an arrow shot by Eochaid from the other side of the valley. Neill ie Doherty, Gallagher, O'Reilly, Quinn (see Surnames box). The findings of the study showed that within the north-west of Ireland as many as 21% of men (8% in the general male population) were concluded to have a common male-line ancestor who lived roughly 1,700 years ago. Abruptly, the tale then has Niall appearing before an assembly of Pictish bards in Scotland, where he is killed by an arrow shot by Eochaid from the other side of the valley. ", Annala Rioghachta Eireann. [3]:7678[7]:220. As the Celtic language in Ireland transformed into Irish between AD 400500, Venii became Fni, and were also known to have called themselves Gadhil (from Common Celtic *wdelos, Brythonic gwddel, Goidelic *wdus to Old Irish Godelmeaning savage woodsman, wild, raider). List of haplogroups of historic people - Wikipedia In My original information was obtained from Genealogy information held at University of Hull. [3] The O'Higgins family claims descent from the Southern branch of U Nill. Niall 'of the Nine Hostages', High King of Ireland (1), Niall 'of the Nine Hostages', High King of Ireland gained the title of King Niall of Tara.1 He gained the title of High King Niall of Ireland in 445.1 Children of Niall 'of the Nine Hostages', High King of Ireland, -1. Irish DNA links to Vikings and Niall of the Nine Hostages Fiachrae is granted a minor royal line two of his descendants, Nath and Ailill Molt, will be High Kings. He conquered the Uliad aristocracy, which ruled in Ulster, and by this victory and subsequent consolidation of power was able to found a dynasty, the Ui Neill, which gave rise to the O'Neill clan. Granted my great great great great paternal ancestor was unknown, and his son took his mothers name (which is my last name). Confirm you are 100% Irish with DNA test | IrishCentral.com Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Thousands of years is a long time. "Can't beat a good Irish pub" - David Beckham celebrates son's birthday in Dublin, UPDATE: Alex Murdaugh sentenced to life in prison for murdering wife and son, WATCH: Irish bishop's funeral held in Los Angeles today, Liam Neeson, Michael D Higgins and Bono among voices featured on "Patrick Kavanagh Almost Everything'". Their father, who was looking on (and who, say some, designedly caused the fire, to test his sons), observed with interest Neill's distinctiveness of character, his good sense and good judgment. So Ireland was a perfect place to host a community Geno 2.0 event.'. In it, Eochaid Mugmedn, the High King of Ireland, had five sons: Four, Brin, Ailill, Fiachrae and Fergus, by his first wife Mongfind, sister of the king of Munster, Crimthann mac Fidaig; and a fifth, Niall, by his second wife Cairenn Chasdub, daughter of Sachell Balb, king of the Saxons. Crimthann returns to Ireland intending to give battle. This was expected of someone of his status in a polygamous society where all chase overdraft fee policy 24 hours; christingle orange cloves; northeast tennessee regional fire training academy; is srco3 soluble in water; basic science topics for nursery 2; bellflower property management; gifts from the holy land bethlehem; In addition to the 100 participants, famous Irish names also participated including former Taoiseach [Prime Minister] of Ireland Enda Kenny and former Minister of State Michael Ring. Variations of this story are told of the earlier Irish high king Lugaid Logde, in Arthurian legendone of the most famous versions appears in both Geoffrey Chaucer's The Wife of Bath's Tale and the related Gawain romance, The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnelleand in John Gower's Middle English poem Confessio Amantis. "In the fifth century, the place was occupied by Niall of the Nine Hostages and it was here that his pagan son, King Laoghaire, was supposed to have been confronted by St. Patrick. In the study scientists found an area in northwest Ireland where they claim 21.5% carry Nialls genetic fingerprint, says Brian McVoy, one of the team at Trinity. 2) 1. iStock. Niall is placed in the traditional list of High Kings of Ireland. distinguish one line of DNA from another. Discord: https://discord.gg/3Jjc3GdmtB, Press J to jump to the feed. least 12 sons. She grants Niall not only water but her name, Alexi, and the kingship for many generations twenty-six of his descendants will be High Kings of Ireland. [14] However, more recently some reservations have been expressed, as the subclade, which is defined by the presence of the marker R-M222, is found in a belt from Northern Ireland across southern Scotland and is not exclusively associated with the U Nill. I confirm that, as stated in this site's Privacy Policy, I do not sell personal information. Sign up to IrishCentral's newsletter to stay up-to-date with everything Irish! The Trinity College study also found that about one in ten men in the west The Annals of the Four Masters dates his accession to 378 and death to 405. Descended from Conaire and a daughter of the High King Conn of the. Yet his fall in a foreign land was to be compassed, not by the strategy or might of the foreign enemy, but by the treachery of one of his own. Niall, who emerges carrying an anvil, is deemed greater than Brin, with a sledgehammer, Fiachrae with bellows and a pail of beer, Ailill with a chest of weapons, and Fergus with a bundle of wood. A subreddit about all things genealogy provided it's not about living people. Niall of the nine hostages : r/23andme - reddit.com (Princess Of Britain ROIGHNEACH was born about 380. Fiachrae gives her a quick peck, but not enough to satisfy her. I was just wandering because it said most Irish have the common ancestor as well. His men carry his body home, fighting seven battles on the way, and his foster-father Torna dies of grief. [6], However, the early annals record the activities of his sons between 429 and 516, an implausibly long time-span for a single generation, leading scholars like Kathleen Hughes[4] and Francis J. Byrne[3]:7879 to conclude that the events of the later half of the 5th century have been extended backwards to accommodate as early a date as possible for the arrival of Saint Patrick, with the effect of pushing Niall back up to half a century. Niall of the Nine Hostages. The mighty warrior king Niall Nogallach dominates the twilight world between history and legend. The Eochaidh who shot the fatal arrow had been King of Leinster, was banished to Alba by Niall, and accompanied Gabhran, Scots Kings #5, chief of the Dal Riada, when Gabhran took troops to France to support an expedition of Niall. have been High King of Ireland. 'The Gathering is a reunion of clans so to speak. Tom Peete Cross & Clark Harris Slover (eds.). We have a common ancestor that 23andMe says is the progenitor of the "Niall of Nine Hostages" dynasty, together with almost 3 million other British Isles males. [3] Laidchenn responds by satirising Leinster so that no corn, grass or leaves grow there for a year. certainty, even if its founder is not. stories say that the future St Patrick was among hostages taken from one such When Niall grows up he returns to Tara and rescues his mother from her labour. Niall makes war in Europe as far as the Alps, and the Romans send an ambassador to parlay with him. niall of the nine hostages 23andme. There was also an Irish Regiment in Sicily in the early 1700s. Especially considering the fact that my paternal line can only be traced back to 1830? Home - Niall of the Nine Hostages - sites.google.com He also led successful raids against Roman Britain & Scotland (some Are McKenna's descendants of Niall of the Nine Hostages? But claiming that you're descended from Niall of the Nine Hostages is BS, because even if it were true, there is no proof. Even if you dont have Irish ancestry, we wish you a Happy St. Patricks day and encourage you to explore the hidden stories in your DNA. He carried back hostages, many captives, and great booty from these expeditions. Although its remarkable that nearly 1 in 10 Americans might say Kiss Me Im Irish! on St. Patricks day, its not clear if all these people actually have Irish ancestors or if they simply feel an affinity for corned beef and green beer. The rise of the U Nill dynasties and their conquests in Ulster and Leinster are not reliably recorded and have been the subject of considerable study and attempts to reconstruct them. or central areas of Scotland have the so-called Niall of the Nine Hostages Ireland's five ancient provinces (Connaught, Munster, Leinster, Ulster and All sources agree he died outside Ireland. [13 ], In January 2006, geneticists at Trinity College, Dublin suggested that Niall may have been the most fecund male in Irish history. Medb, for example, was said to have participated in a ritual union with nine of the high kings, preventing the rule of any candidates who refused to mate with her. His father, Eochaid Muig Medon, son of Muiredeach, became Ard Rich mid way of the fourth century. Privacy Policy. Privacy Policy. Brin defeats Fiachrae and hands him over as a prisoner to Niall, but Fiachrae's son Nath continues the war and eventually kills Brin. Keating associates these raids with those mentioned by Gildas and Bede, and deduces that, since some Irish sources say Patrick was abducted from Brittany, that Niall's raids must have extended to continental Europe as well.[3]. [6 ], King Of Ireland & Tara Niall Mor NOIGIALLACH, Died: Abt 453, Tara, Ireland about age 73. Niall Nogallach (Old Irish "having nine hostages") (pronounced [ni%CB%90%CB%88%C9%99l nojilax])[1], or in English, Niall of the Nine Hostages, son of Eochaid Mugmedn, was an Irish king, the eponymous ancestor of the U Nill kindred who dominated Ireland from the 6th century to the 10th century. Niall of the Nine Hostages , or Niall Nigiallach, was the youngest son of Eochaidh Mugmedon (King of Connacht). Fergus and Ailill refuse and return empty-handed. Such Yet, my paternal Haplogroup is "R-CTS241", which seems to be heavily common of people from the UK, yet my 23andme shows absolutely 0 percentage coming from the UK, actually none from western europe in general.I also share a paternal line ancestor with "Niall of the nine hostages". McManus, Molloy, Reilly, Rourke and Quinn. County Mayo residents were fascinated to learn that there is Viking DNA in their makeup, a fact . I'm obtaining my Portuguese citizenship due to this heritage. I, A Social History of Ancient Ireland, Vol. [10], While Niall is high king, his brothers establish themselves as local kings. [7] O'Rahilly suggests that the nine hostages were from the kingdom of the Airgialla (literally "hostage-givers"), a satellite state founded by the Ui Nill's conquests in Ulster, noting that the early Irish legal text Lebor na gCeart ("The Book of Rights") says that the only duty of the Airgialla to the King of Ireland was to give him nine hostages. Keating, quoting a Latin Life of Saint Patrick, says that Niall led Irish raids on Roman Britain, and in one of those raids Patrick and his sisters were abducted. tales as these old hag transformed by physical intimacy of a young man are 23andMe does test for this marker, so they are telling you you are M222+. [4 ] Famous descendants include Niall's great-great grandson Saint Columba, Saint Mel Ruba, theKings of Ailech, the Kings of Tir Eogain, and the Kings of Tr Conaill. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. The geneticists estimated that about 23 million men bear this haplotype. We would expect to find a large concentration of Niall's descendants there, as the Southern U Nill were dominant in that region, but we do not. 23andMe will give you the basic results for Ydna but . [9], In another story, the succession is not settled when Eochaid dies, and Mongfind's brother Crimthann takes the high kingship. The Primitive Irish Vendo is a cognate with Finn, and the Fianna were landless, aristocratic young men and women who had not yet come into their inheritance of land. But while he is away on a tour of his lands in Scotland, Mongfind's sons seize Ireland. According to National Geographic, the Mayo County Council hosted the Genographic Project for the Gathering under the theme of diaspora and cultural exchange. While Cairenn is pregnant with Niall, the jealous Mongfind forces her to do heavy work, hoping to make her miscarry. Brin defeats Fiachrae and hands him over as a prisoner to Niall, but Fiachrae's son Nath continues the war and eventually kills Brin. Niall's first expedition was into Alba to subdue the Picts. He is presumed to have been a real person, but most of the information about him that has come down to us is legendary. Since women dont inherit a Y chromosome, they must trace their paternal line through their fathers, brothers or paternal uncles Y-chromosome data. and tr. The haplogroup that is associated with Niall of the Nine Hostages is M222, which is part of M269 but definitely not the same thing. Legend accords him at Then his father said: "It is Niall who should succeed me as Ard Righ of Eirinn". 279. r/23andme. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Brin rules the province of Connacht, but Fiachrae makes war against him. [4], [edit]L egendary biography[edit ]Early life, Although it is anachronistic for Niall's mother to have been a Saxon, O'Rahilly argues that the name Cairenn is derived from the Latin name Carina, and that it is plausible that she might have been a Romano-Briton. Menu. the first high king of Ireland. The Annals of Inisfallen date his death before 382, and the Chronicon Scotorum to 411. If 23andMe says you're M222+, that part is not BS. [7]:222232 O'Rahilly and Byrne argue that the literary sources, though late and garbled, preserve genuine traditions that Niall led raids on Britain, and perhaps died on one. [4] The later Annals of the Four Masters dates his reign to 379405,[5] and the chronology of Geoffrey Keating's Foras Feasa ar irinn to 368395. However, the traditional roll of kings and its chronology is now recognised as artificial. Brin rules the province of Connacht, but Fiachrae makes war against him. So, although it doesnt completely verify the story, this one branch of my ancestral tree is at least consistent with claims of Irish ancestry on my mothers side. November 25, 2016. The Genographic Project Team, who conducted the study, returned to County Mayo to reveal the ancestry results of 100 local residents who participated in the Gathering Ireland event in June 2013. Distant view of Round Tower at Glendalough Across the island as a whole, a different sub-clade the M269 pattern is In Italy the Irish were primarily found in Milan and Naples - deployed there by Spain. Variations of this story are told of the earlier Irish high king Lugaid Logde, in Arthurian legend one of the most famous versions appears in both Geoffrey Chaucer's The Wife of Bath's Tale and the related Gawain romance, The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnell and in John Gower's Middle English poem Confessio Amantis. [5] Mongfind appears to have been a supernatural personage: the saga "The Death of Crimthann mac Fidaig" says the festival of Samhain was commonly called the "Festival of Mongfind", and prayers were offered to her on Samhain eve. Niall fitted out a large fleet and sailed to the assistance of his people. Niall of the Nine Hostages : r/23andme - reddit Variations of this story are told of the earlier Irish high king Lugaid Logde, in Arthurian legend one of the most famous versions appears in both Geoffrey Chaucer's The Wife of Bath's Tale and the related Gawain romance, The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnell and in John Gower's Middle English poem Confessio Amantis. Birth of Conall Gulban mac Nill, King of Tirconal, Birth of Cairbre mac Nill, High King of Ireland, 126th HIgh KIng of Ireland, Greatest High King of Ireland, aka Nial Mor NAOIGHIALLACH `of the Nine Hostages'; 1st King (but reckoned 126th MONARCH) of IRELAND; conquered nine countries (incl. however, steps right up to the mark, agreeing not only to kiss her but also to The southern Venii came to be known as the Eoghanacht, while another group of them migrated north and formed a new kingdom west of the River Shannon where they became known as the Connachta after a revered leader named Conn. [6] O'Rahilly suggests that the nine hostages were from the kingdom of the Airgialla (literally "hostage-givers"), a satellite state founded by the Ui Nill's conquests in Ulster, noting that the early Irish legal text Lebor na gCeart ("The Book of Rights") says that the only duty of the Airgialla to the King of Ireland was to give him nine hostages.[7]. Niall belongs to Haplogroup R1b1c7 (M222). Niall exiles him to Scotland. He eventually came to control most of the Northern half of Ireland. Niall releases Fiachrae, who becomes king of Connacht and Niall's right hand man. There is a large community of M222 men and a very interesting "family tree" of sorts is emerging as these men get into Y-DNA testing. [13], In January 2006, geneticists at Trinity College, Dublin suggested that Niall may have been the most fecund male in Irish history. Most of the Milesian kings ruled from Tara. ), "The Story of Eochaidh Muighmedin's Sons", in, Stokes, Whitley (ed. "Niall's ships brought many captives back to Ireland. Keating associates these raids with those mentioned by Gildas and Bede, and deduces that, since some Irish sources say Patrick was abducted from Brittany, that Niall's raids must have extended to continental Europe as well.[3]. Crimthann refuses to drink it unless she does too; they both drink, and both die. The center of his government was at Tara. Mongfind refuses to accept the decision. He was killed in his sleep while aboard his royal galley. When she was pregnant with Niall, Eochaid's first wife Mongfind was jealous and made her do heavy labour, hoping to make her . latter a misleading term that should not be construed as meaning the bearer had A significant proportion of One day, the five brothers being in the smith's forge when it took fire, they were commanded to run and save what they could. And any explanations why it would be present in my ancestry? [6] Laidchenn responds by satirising Leinster so that no corn, grass or leaves grow there for a year. Copyright Claire Santry 2008-2023 Irish-Genealogy-Toolkit.com. [6], http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niall_of_the_Nine_Hostages. One of them, Patrick, was the sixteen-year old son of a British Roman official. [19][20] According to the PBS documentary series Finding Your Roots, Bill O'Reilly, Stephen Colbert, Colin Quinn, Bill Maher, and the show's host, Henry Louis Gates, Jr. all display STR markers consistent with the Irish Modal Haplotype. The geneticists estimated that there are about 2-3 million males alive today who descend in the male-line from Niall. [7], Although it is anachronistic for Niall's mother to have been a Saxon, O'Rahilly argues that the name Cairenn is derived from the Latin name Carina, and that it is plausible that she might have been a Romano-Briton. [6], Keating credits Niall with two wives: Inne, daughter of Lugaid, who bore him one son, Fiachu; and Rignach, who bore him seven sons, Legaire, ndae, Maine, Egan, Conall Gulban, Conall Cremthainne and Coirpre.